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D-18V

 
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freddairy



Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 2:35 pm    Post subject: D-18V Reply with quote

Seeing that I'm not going to get a used 50s D-18 or anything else close to Clarences guitar in the cheap range I decided to buy this.
[img]
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemVersion&item=230444323885&view=all&tid=0[/img]

It went for about 300-350 less than the going price of a D-18V and I think it's because of the poor pictures. Upon arrival at my place yesterday morning I found what appears to be a almost new 2008 D-18v. The case in the pictures on the ebay auction looks all dusty and worn, not so. This guy took the worst pictures and I think I may have benifited from that.

I did a little a/bing with the D-18GE. Here's what I found:

Playability: For me the D-18V has the edge when it comes to flatpicking. I've been working through the Clarence White book and I've had trouble doing some runs off an anchored C chord with the D-18GE neck. I've also had trouble on that guitar doing the down down up crosspicking. The closer strings on the D-18V make that so much easier. Which is odd, because I'm a big guy with large hands.
Lastly, I can finally capo way up on the 5th fret and play Dark Hollow and not have to stretch my fingers so much on the V as I did the GE.

Fingerpicking the D-18 GE is a bit easier.

Tone: My D-18GE is a 2003 and I feel it may have had a chance to open up more. The D-18V does not sound like a pre-war Martin as much as the GE. The tone is really tight and has more bassey mid tones. The GE is louder, but in a more brass, almost out of control way.

I'll try to get some better pics.
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Dogbear



Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 275
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 2:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The D-18V does not sound like a pre-war Martin as much as the GE.


D-18V has a Sitka top and Sitka braces, D-18 GE has an Adirondack top with Adirondack braces. Couldn't be more different.
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Brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Posts: 1360
Location: Southern California

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes it could it could be a Taylor Cool
Laughing
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freddairy



Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dogbear wrote:
Quote:
The D-18V does not sound like a pre-war Martin as much as the GE.


D-18V has a Sitka top and Sitka braces, D-18 GE has an Adirondack top with Adirondack braces. Couldn't be more different.


True, but they both have the prewar scalloped bracing. The Golden Era has what Martin refers to as Golden Era styling which appears to just be the addition of the cloth side bracing. I think the bracing style though actually makes them pretty similar. Especially if you were to compare to any post 1940s straight braced vintage D-18.

I did a lot of A/Bing the two this weekend. The D-18V has more of the classic Martin Bluegrass tone.
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Dogbear



Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 275
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Yes it could it could be a Taylor


We are not going there.................. Shocked

Quote:
but they both have the prewar scalloped bracing.


You missed my point. Sitka and Adi are very different in tonal response. That fact alone makes them not similar at all. Adi is often described as more touch responsive and clearer when it comes to separating notes than Sitka. It a nutshell, they sound different no matter how they are braced.
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Murr



Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 384
Location: http://www.youtube.com/user/skydogz1

PostPosted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It all adds up ...bracing, top wood, side and back woods, plus the differences between each individual guitar with the same specs.

As for tops, I hear adirondack as being slightly scooped in the mids.

As for back and sides, to my ears, rosewood intensifies a certain range of frequencies, somewhere in the mids to lower mid range.


Btw, congratulations freddairy on the D-18V. I think its a good choice.
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Dogbear



Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 275
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As for being slightly scooped in the mids, I haven't heard that in any of the adi tops that I have heard or played. What I have heard is that adi when properly braced has greater volume, power and sensitivity than other types of spruce.

It is important to note that Adirondack or Red Spruce was the preferred wood for flat picking guitar tops prior to WWll (GE). The vast use of red spruce for aircraft and other war craft vastly deleted the stock piles of this wood. Even today, custom guitar makers are finding it hard to find good quality suitable adi logs. Close, straight grained AAAA grade woods in dreadnought sizes are very rare and expensive.

I agree with you on Indian Rosewood. Sometimes mahogany has a better tone range and is more preferable than Indian. Brazilian on the other hand is different; it has sparkle on the high end that is not found in other woods.

And yes, congrats on the D-18V. It is a very nice guitar.
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Murr



Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 384
Location: http://www.youtube.com/user/skydogz1

PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Btw, it should be noted that flatpicking as we know it wasn't born until well into the sitka top era. The adirondack era would be players like Jimmie Rodgers, aside from the jazz guys playin L5's and such.
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Brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Posts: 1360
Location: Southern California

PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Murr wrote:
Btw, it should be noted that flatpicking as we know it wasn't born until well into the sitka top era. The adirondack era would be players like Jimmie Rodgers, aside from the jazz guys playin L5's and such.


I was just going to say this... Clarence, Doc and Tony developed during the 50's, 60's, and 70's during Martins' non-golden era but certainly the golden era for groundbreaking flatpicking.

My guess is that the development of the modern day focus on 'pre-war' Martins developed from guitar enthusiasts, collectors, luthiers. The players played whatever was available or what they could afford.
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Murr



Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 384
Location: http://www.youtube.com/user/skydogz1

PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Btw, regarding the timeline, I wouldn't group Tony in with Doc and Clarence -since he came on the scene later.

The origin and development of fiddle-tune flatpicking is Doc and Clarence.
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freddairy



Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2010 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Murr wrote:
Btw, regarding the timeline, I wouldn't group Tony in with Doc and Clarence -since he came on the scene later.

The origin and development of fiddle-tune flatpicking is Doc and Clarence.


Doc and Clarence are my two favorite flatpickers. Maybe that's why I like the sitka top more than the adi, but that said, I think Clarence and Doc woulda sounded great on a Silvercreek.
I've never been a huge fan of Tony Rice... I know I should be flogged for this huh?

I did a brief recording this afternoon of the D-18V. I had just put on a set of Martin Bluegrass strings. I usually use John Pearse PBs, but I REALLY like these Martin strings. A bit bassier and even make the D-18V sound more refined in that department.

Here's a link http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=1025850&content=songinfo&songID=8920970
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Dogbear



Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 275
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2010 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
it should be noted that flatpicking as we know it wasn't born until well into the sitka top era.


And all those guys played guitars that were new.... Many played guitars that were made in the late 30's and early 40's? They played guitars that were cheap and readily available. Doc played a lot of cheap stuff, an early D28, and even a Lester. When Clarence bought #58957, a 1935 Martin D-28 Herringbone in the late 1950's from McCabes Music in Los Angeles, it was not a vintage guitar....it was a beat up one with lots of issues. It also had an adi top.

The reason for my post was not to talk about time lines, but to let you know that if you want an adi topped guitar, it getting much harder to find good wood. Sitka is always in abundant supply.
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Murr



Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 384
Location: http://www.youtube.com/user/skydogz1

PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2010 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats some fast pickin'.
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freddairy



Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Murr wrote:
Thats some fast pickin'.


Thank you sir! Still trying to get my cross picking patterns down. Too much time spent chicken pickin' in my youth.
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